Whats Wrong With This Picture?

[Garhan]

 

 

 

 

 

What am I thinking, we dont need a new form of marketing for ourselves or do we? I found these up in a box store. One out of two that I travelled to yesterday. I wonder if it is the same at all the box stores? Or is there something we could do about this? Why dont we do something like this, but better? What would be wrong about not doing something like this? I wonder if this can be done in St.Albert, Sherwood Park, Stoney Plain, Spruce Grove, Leduc, Michaels stores, Canadian Tires, Walmarts, Gibbons, Bon Accord?

I dont think this box store could or would say no, seeing how they already make room to recruit for others…..mmmmm. Or would they. If they would say no, then that tells me there is a some foul about that needs to be amended and cleaned up.

 

Just a few questions that ran through my head

 

After all there has been many discussion in various circles about this very topic. Why talk about it when the others have already laid out the business plan to follow. Kind of a no brainer to me.

[Junior]

I could be wrong, but it seems to me that we laid the business plan out for them. In the past we had brochures, business cards, signage and contact info at various retail locations, although not as extensively as you suggest. In my experience, this form of advertising is only as effective as the in-store support it gets. If a staff member is going to direct someone to the club it works. To be honest, it works regardless of whether there's promotional material or not. If the sincerity and enthusiasm are there, something as simple as a staff member writing on a post-it, "Look up Northern Lights," is all it takes. Without that hypothetical staff member, it'll take a lot more than a letter sized photocopy to make any difference.

 

Not stating facts, just an informed opinion.

[Garhan]

Actually I am not suggesting we do anymore than we have in the past. But if they are willing and we have the how to....then what would be wrong with taking up some free space they would make available This at best becomes an intangible for most marketing schemes. To suggest that it doesnt work, if you dont have something up is a guess at best. A guarantee of a100% failure is only eminent if you never try to market yourself. I can promise you that statistic is accurate from my marketing background. Everyones response to advertising is a bit different in fashion. Consistency is and always has been the key to a good add campaign. Unless you have a urgent time line for the potential client to meet a quick flash add isnt effective. I dont think our potential clientele base has any urgence. So put it up and leave it up for a few years. This will give again a result that is difficult to monitor or survey with any certainty. But it does not mean that it is not effective.

 

Currently there is nothing on site.

[dave robinson]

I'm all for a flyer and a few brochures or business cards, particularly emphasizing the TU part.

Even if it doesn't bring in scads of new members (or even a few) it might just raise the public consciousness of TU

such that when we have a public stance on something, say regulation changes, Trout Unlimited won't draw as many blank looks.

And as for effectiveness, I'll quote Wayne Gretzky "100% of the shots you don't take don't go in".

[Garhan]

I'm all for a flyer and a few brochures or business cards, particularly emphasizing the TU part.

Even if it doesn't bring in scads of new members (or even a few) it might just raise the public consciousness of TU

such that when we have a public stance on something, say regulation changes, Trout Unlimited won't draw as many blank looks.

And as for effectiveness, I'll quote Wayne Gretzky "100% of the shots you don't take don't go in".

 

[Junior]

I didn't mean we shouldn't do anything, just that we should consult with our resident marketing experts about how we could improve upon the past. I'm not one of those experts, but I think we should put together a marketing plan for the club.

[DennisS]

all very good points maybe the one thing to take a look at is making ourselves more visable in some of local sport shops. Maybe make arrangement to have a person or persons in stores on a weekend doing tying & talking up the club and what we do. I'm sure most stores would like to have us there. It's something that I will bring up to the excutive

As Jr says maybe it is time to get a marketing commettee up and running.

 

Let keep up the great subject with more idea's on how to bring more people into the club. The idea the better.

 

Tight Lines Always

Dennis S

[Garhan]

Well the marketing expert I am sure could just jump into this thread, if they would like. Who is our marketing expert anyways?

 

Personally I think more along the line, like Dennis and feel that this should be a committee as opposed to an individual. As long as there is at least one person on the committee that has some marketing experience, then the idea can be tweaked. This like other positions take more than one to carry the burden. A business plan can be written with long term agreements by those on the issuer or location end. That way you are not redoing this every year. After the business plan is written it should be adopted as a living program that can be adjusted as time, conditions and environments change.

 

So a key point obviously is to recruit a staff member or two from each store that is a direct retailer of fishing products. Mabe not so much with CT, Wallmart. Nothing like some inside work moving in your direction.

[Junior]

Actually, Gary, I was including you in the "experts"(note the plurality), since you stated that you have a marketing background. Then again, I suppose you did also suggest that we should do no more than we have in the past. Sorry if I misunderstood.

 

And I never suggested handing the hot potato to one individual. Not sure how you construed that from, "we should consult," and, "we should put together..."

[Garhan]

I didn't mean we shouldn't do anything, just that we should consult with our resident marketing experts about how we could improve upon the past.

 

Are you being vicious, again. Should have known.

 

We cannot change our past. Anymore than we can not change the fact that people act in a certain way. We can not change the inevitable. The only thing we can do is play on the one string we have, and that is our attitude. We are all faced with a series of great opportunities that are disguised as imposible situations.

[dave robinson]

Resident marketing experts? I'm not sure we have any. Bill Gouge is a camera product rep. Does that count?

 

To date our marketing consist of the outreach things we do:

Beginners Fly Tying Seminars, January Fly Fishing Seminars, Learn to Fly Fish Seminars, Annual Fundraiser,

A presence at the Annual TU Dinner adn Acution, Kids Tying at outdoor shows, ad hock tying instructions for scouts etc.

We have done tying and casting demos at the major fishing stores (Fishin' Hole, Cabellas)

 

We do have brochures at the major fishing stores and we place posters there for our major events

I also e-mail the monthly newsletter to the stores and a couple of other places

 

I carry around some "business cards" with club info that I hand out at every opportunity

Those have been made available to club members in the past and could be again.

 

What we haven't done is hit some retailers like Canadian Tire, Wallmart and I suppose Target or whomever else invades Canada.

We also haven't approached City Parks and Rec or The Edmonton Public School Board

to see if we can offer assistance for their fly fishing program the odd time they offer it

 

We did have one teacher approach us last year to help her with a possilbe program, but it kinda died at her end.

 

Beyond that. I'm open to ideas.

Edited December 4, 2012 by dave robinson

[DennisS]

This discussion is getting a bit on the livily said. I'm liking it. As you say Dave we don't really have any marketing people that we know of so that does present a small problem.

I really think Gary hit the nail on the head regarding what is the club plan and how are we going to get there. If I remember correctly a couple of years ago Merv proposed a question that a lot of members were kind of shocked at. That question was "where do each of us see our club at in 5yr." It was bantied around but nothing ever became of it. Maybe it's time to get serious and take a good hard look and start to actually put some kind of plan in place. Right now if we were to look down the road it's not looking all that great. I'm thinking a committee would be the way to go. We would need imput from the club members and we should devise a way to get some imput from the public on what would make them want to come out to our meetings.

 

Just some food for thought guys

 

Tight Lines Always

Dennis S

[Garhan]

Resident marketing experts? I'm not sure we have any. Bill Gouge is a camera product rep. Does that count?

 

To date our marketing consist of the outreach things we do:

Beginners Fly Tying Seminars, January Fly Fishing Seminars, Learn to Fly Fish Seminars, Annual Fundraiser,

A presence at the Annual TU Dinner adn Acution, Kids Tying at outdoor shows, ad hock tying instructions for scouts etc.

We have done tying and casting demos at the major fishing stores (Fishin' Hole, Cabellas)

 

We do have brochures at the major fishing stores and we place posters there for our major events

I also e-mail the monthly newsletter to the stores and a couple of other places

 

I carry around some "business cards" with club info that I hand out at every opportunity

Those have been made available to club members in the past and could be again.

 

What we haven't done is hit some retailers like Canadian Tire, Wallmart and I suppose Target or whomever else invades Canada.

We also haven't approached City Parks and Rec or The Edmonton Public School Board

to see if we can offer assistance for their fly fishing program the odd time they offer it

 

We did have one teacher approach us last year to help her with a possilbe program, but it kinda died at her end.

 

Beyond that. I'm open to ideas.

 

First, before someone drags me down to there level. I didn't say I was an expert. If I did my name would be Dr.G.G.Han...and I don't run that designation. I have said I have been in sales and marketing in a professional global industry and this has been my background for 30 years to be clear. In case there was any confusion what so ever.

 

Dave I like many of your comments and statements. All I am suggesting is that we put up our name in every retail outlet that will allow us to do so, that is not indifferent to our needs. Each of the venues that you mentioned are great for NLFT, but they are all events that the potential new member would have to go to and make time in their schedules to do so. Which is OK and we ride on someone elses dime to get those people to these events, thats good stuff. They are great targets. But people that just fly past or are new to the area seem for some reason to have difficulty making a connection to our club and cause. The grass roots would be to intercept them in a normal day of shopping and travelling. (step1) if you will. (Airports, Bus stations, train stations come to mind)

 

Other retailers might surprise us as I don't know if they have been approached. I do know that when Blair Krits was managing the west end CT, I am sure he would have allowed us to put up a small poster or brochure holder. Further I feel the Girl Guides of Canada, Big Brothers and Big Sisters all could benefit from our club. Especially B.B. and B.S. because those folks are always looking for something different to do with the children they are matched with. Coming to a club meeting for free would be a great, safe, venue for both.

I also like the Parks and Rec approach and I am wondering if yearly or quarterly outdoor magazinse would give free ad space to a non profit organization or club like NLFT. All we have to do is ask or even barter or trade time at shows in there booths. You never know until you ask. And a "no" would not hurt us anyways, if they are inclined to say so.

 

I am not sure if there are club members or forum members that have any experience with B.B. and B.S. that could share some thoughts with us here and express any possible pluses or negatives to the idea.

[DennisS]

Gray & Dave all great idea's. This has really gotten me doing some thinking(be careful that my not be a good thing) First I like the BB & BS idea that could be a really good thing. Also another thought would get some younger flyfishing presenters. I've heard of a couple in the States but do we have any young people' first here in AB that we could get to come out or in Canada in General. Also the other thought is we could start bringing in books & DVD that are also geared to the younger generations of flyfishers.

I think if you go to some of the malls they will allow groups to set up and do presentations and promote their organizations. In malls we could even set up casting lane and we could be tying at the same time.

Just more food for thought keep the idea's coming.

 

Tight Lines Always

Dennis S

[Garhan]

Gray & Dave all great idea's. This has really gotten me doing some thinking(be careful that my not be a good thing) First I like the BB & BS idea that could be a really good thing. Also another thought would get some younger flyfishing presenters. I've heard of a couple in the States but do we have any young people' first here in AB that we could get to come out or in Canada in General. Also the other thought is we could start bringing in books & DVD that are also geared to the younger generations of flyfishers.

I think if you go to some of the malls they will allow groups to set up and do presentations and promote their organizations. In malls we could even set up casting lane and we could be tying at the same time.

Just more food for thought keep the idea's coming.

 

Tight Lines Always

Dennis S

 

I like the idea of younger presenters with both a local or a non local flavour. There are some out there that I personally don't make a connection with. But that is OK because it isn't people in my age demographic we are after anyways. And there are many available that still cater to that older demographic out there today. It is like you said younger presenters that have made a connection with the younger demographic that is key. I believe one of our other members made the suggestion to bring in April Volkey. I would support that myself. Not because I am any kind of a fan, but because April has exactly that connection with the demographic we are discussing. I would still go and see her presentation none the less. But like I said I would not have the same connection to her as the younger groups would. Just a thought. Who ever suggested her was right on the money.

[Junior]

Thanks, Gary. Vicious, and right on the money. I like it.

 

When I spoke to April Vokey last year, she was skeptical that there would be enough interest in a steelhead specialist. The idea went over like a lead balloon with the club, at first. Maybe the tide is turning. If there's enough interest from the club, I'd be happy to re-open that conversation with her.

 

Those who went to the Calgary Fly Expo either of the last two years may have come across Aidan Darby Miller. He was working with Courtney Ogilvy at the Nile Creek Fly Shop booth. Hailing from the wet coast, most of his experience is also with salmon and steelhead, but he tyes pike flies that will blow your mind. And he lives in Calgary now, so I imagine he's got some new stuff for trout. Kyle Snarr is on the Canadian Youth Fly Fishing Team, and guides out of Bow River Troutfitters. I don't think either of them is old enough to vote, but they'd both make good presenters. I'm friends with both of them. Again, if there's interest in the general membership of the club, not just a few of us here on the forum, let me know and I'll get in touch.

 

The BB/BS idea is brilliant. A real, "Why didn't I think of that?" moment.

[Garhan]

I like the idea of those young presenter that you mentioned Junior. Bring that kind of talent in with their social media and fishing connections to the younger demographic people is what I think we need to do. So as to bring new younger people to NLFT. It isn't the current members we are after it is the potentially new and we should keep our focus on that group. Hopefully getting them on the forum will also be a added advantage. As for current members and the older groups we should and likely will still cater to them, but they will have to share the light. Besides when did my generation become the old foggies....mmmmmm I didnt get that memo and refuse to be that way in my thinking, if I recall it was the Boomers that were going to change the world and make it a good place to live with ln peace dudes. Remember...

 

Some one once mentioned to me that our older membership group doesnt work well with computers and to bring current member or to get them active on the forum was related to there age group. I have a difficult time swallowing that idea. I think the older group has more time than ever to learn how to run a computer if that is the case and they certainly have a huge resource available to them to do so. You dont have to be good to login and type a password. Out of 700 plus members we then would have 670 (estimate) that are computer illiterate, based on the older membership thinking. I doubt that very much. I think that you can see to much without logging in and therefore it isn't done. If you go on other sites you barely scratch the surface without logging in. But this is a whole different topic.

[Junior]

The resident marketing expert I was referring to hasn't chimed in here, yet has been active on the board, so I'll refrain from volunteering that person's name.

[Junior]

I wouldn't want to waste a good opportunity with the young presenters. Maybe we could coordinate their visits with a school group, or the BB/BS, something like that.

[Garhan]

I wouldn't want to waste a good opportunity with the young presenters. Maybe we could coordinate their visits with a school group, or the BB/BS, something like that.

 

I wouldn't want to waste a good opportunity with the young presenters. Maybe we could coordinate their visits with a school group, or the BB/BS, something like that.

 

Can you expand on your comment. Seems vague to me...

[DennisS]

RIck & Gary good Chatter I'm liking what I'm reading. Rick could you check with these young people to see if their interested in doing some promotion regarding getting younger people envolved in Fly Fishing. Let them know that I will give them a call. If their interested you can give me their contact info & I can give them a call.

My thought and it just mine at the moment we could maybe get one or both to do some things at the Sportsman show. I could talk to Pam one of the organizers and set up something like a couple of talks or mayby talks and some fly casting demo's. That would be a start.

Regarding the BB & BS do they have a monthly meeting where we can introduce ourselves and put forward a proposal of some sort.

 

I've thought of getting April out but if it's just steelheading it will be tough.

 

I spoke to Floren last night to check into getting some books & DVD's that is Geared for the the younger generation. That to then can be a bit of draw when we have stuff in our Liberary that they and can relate to. It also shows we aren't excluding them.

 

There more Food for Thought

 

Tight Lines Always

Dennis S

[Junior]

That's a weird glitch, where it double quotes.

 

I just mean, as I understand it, we want to bring in younger presenters to attract new young members. I don't see how we'll accomplish that if we just bring April, Aidan, or Kyle in on any old night, put it in the newsletter and hope for good numbers of club regulars to show up, and maybe bring a kid. I suggest we book them with good lead time, and then promote it to youth groups as a special event. I guess the case with April is a little different, as she needs to be booked a lot further in advance, and I think she typically gets paid for her presentations these days.

[DennisS]

Junior your right, it would be hard to bring them in on a meeting night and accomplish our goal. It would have to be a speacial event and yes it would have to be advertized with lots of lead time. We would need to target the youth organizations for sure. Maybe somehow we should be doing that anyway. Maybe something like having them come to us instead of us going to them. We could work up a night just for young people if we knew they we're coming out.

 

 

Apirl again is something different as you say.

 

Tight Lines Always

 

Dennis S

[SnoWolf]

ok. If we are going to run with this then here is my two cents. The demogarphic we are aiming at could care less about April Volkey and two dudes from Cowgary...! (I am interested in April Volkey and steelhead) They are going to want to come out once a week and sit downstairs with a couple of fuddy duddies and tie some flies, end of story. My kids loved comming to see everyone but they where always way to bored during the presentation. Once they had some tools and could tie flies it was much better for them.

 

So I propose the club purchase 20 middle of the road pedestal vices. Not the cheap garbage that comes in the begginer kits sold at stores. As well 20 sets of good tools ie; bobbins, scissors, whip finishers, ect. Then from there we choose 5 dry and 5 wet flies with similar materials and purchase enough to tie 100 flies to start with. We could put together a list of what we wish to purchase and submit it with a letter of our intentions to Tha Fishin Hole, Wholesale Sports, Cabella's and Fish Tales and have them each give us a quote. They can choose the brand names as each has different suppliers as long as the quality is good and then the membership can vote on who's quote to accept.

 

Then from there we will need a program for them and the volunteer fuddy duddies to follow so they can learn to tie the ten chosen patterns, one or two per week. They do not have to join the club to start but it's wrong to give them something for nothing so the cost for each night should be $2.00 per person under the age of 18(free for the BB/BS/UAL) and $5.00 for people over 18 years old and they keep the flies they tie. Over 18's buy a membership after the first year.

 

The beauty of this set up is that we can continue to have our regular meetings upstairs and the beginners group will be downstairs doing their thing with the volunteers and when they are ready and willing they can move up to join the main group.

[Garhan]

Well if we get a Flytying Course implemented it can easily be broken down to this.