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Edmonton Lakes

Don Andersen

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Spent last Thursday through Monday sampling 2 of the lakes in the western Edmonton area. Fished Muir on Thursday afternoon and Firday all day. Caught fish too!! Not big ones and not a sack full, but some. Was somewhat disappointed in the growth rate. Would have expected that the second year stocking would have at least matched Beaver. [ Second year by this time is 3 lbs. + ]. Did see a fair pile of bugs though. The folks that have done work on the lake site should be commended.

Off to Star lake on Saturday, Sunday and Monday. Didn't land nearly as many fish as @ Muir but the size was up. Did catch some from 3>6 lbs. Surprised that I didn't catch any of the 12>14" range [ second year stocking ]. Lots of tiddlers @ 8" and a few larger @ 18>24".

What I found most interesting was fishing an urban environment. Traffic noises, airplanes flying, lawnmowers running, paddle boats splashing & kids playing. While I found it uncomforable as I am usually away from such noises, my companions seemed not to notice it till I pointed the noise out. Seemily, they accepted it as part of the background and ignored it.

And there was some bait dunkers @ Muir. And know, they didn't last long. A thunderstorm arrived and they departed.

And some the shore fishermen @ Star are a dirty bunch. Three guys from the county [ I think ] spent more than 1/2 hour picking up the trash. A good use for your tax $'s. Pleased to see that the similar folks exist your way. Thought they may be all @ Dixon, Beaver or Twin lakes.

From what I saw, I'll plan another trip up your way. You've got some interesting lakes.


catch ya'




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Don - Glad you got to spend some time on the lakes. This is arguably the worst time of the season, and yes, there are some lunkers out at Muir - but fewer than I had expected too - no matter. They do grow!


Do you have the same problem around Rocky with the bait fishers on these special regs waters?


I'd love to know the magic solution - education? Enforcement? A combination?


Perhaps special metal detectors before you hit the dock that are tuned to look for hills brothers coffee cans.



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Don, glad to spend some time fishing with you and Michael. Interesting points you made about our urban trout lakes while on the water. I guess it's my turn to get down to your neck of the woods and fish Beaver for a few days. Also interested in trying out your secret cereal Chironomid material. I'll give it a shot for sure.


Cheers :cheers:


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While I didn't invent it, I'm certainly going to take advantage of it. The Program is called - - - CRIME PAYS. Any and all times I see the fishing regulations being broken, I call it in and - guess what - RAP pays me. And where is the money to be used - to pay for my cell service and add to the coffers of more habitat projects.

So if you want more projects like Muir Lake and the $'s to pay for them, rat out a law breaker. Screw educating them. I've had enough. Approx. 30% of all anglers visiting Beaver Lake are breaking the law.

This message is brought to you in interests of conservation. Let the CO's do the education.


catch ya'




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Good on you Don , I believe thats the only way to get the point across. Some people JUST DON"T GET IT!!!! It seems rules are ment to be broken, NOT!!

Planning on fishing Swan in a week or so, any news how the fishin is? I hope I have better luck then the last time out there, ( over 15 years ago).


Good luck the next time your up north.......

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Thanks for the compliments but I beg to differ on how to deal with poachers. It is way better to get people on side by having them see that adopting a new fishing behaviour is better for them and the resource than just beating them into submission by calling the fish cops.


I fish Muir a lot and I don't think our poaching rate is any where near 30 %, if I see somone breaking the rules, I tell them that I would not like to see them get busted for fishing they way they are and then I explain the rules and the reason behind the rules to them. If they adopt the proper behaviour then I move on, if they don't then I call the number. 99% of the people make the switch or leave and most of them apologize profusely for their lack of judgement. The whole interaction is done in a quiet, respectful tone. The last thing I want to do is get someone to break the rules just to spite my uppity attitude (and we all know a number of Albertans that hate being told what to do).


Personally I would eventually like almost all pothole lakes with some sort of delayed-harvest model, but that ain't gonna happen unless the people who support the concept start winning over them bait fishers - cause they be in the majority. George Mitchell did a hell of a lot of angler education, so did Martin and they were pretty good guys that got a lot accomplished.





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A couple of things:


1] Identifying and turning in law breakers. I tried the low key approach a number of times. Responses varied but rarely resulted in anybody stopping fishing. I've got a better things to do with my time than try to convince that someone that is stealing from me they shouldn't be doing it. Several instances come to mind; a + 60 year old gal leaning against the bait sign while fishing bait and the guy who told me while fishing with 2 rods and bait "nobody will care if I catch my supper". And the off repeated "but PowerBait isn't bait" with the response from me "what part of the word BAIT in PowerBait don't you understand". And frankly @ 60>75% compliance with posted regulations scares the poo outta me. What about all the areas that are not posted - like nearly all of the province. Naw, Tim - I'm not longer the nice guy when it comes to fishing infractions. And if you/me and the everyone else don't quit soft pedaling the criminals, we will have no fishing left. The law breakers take advantage of us. They know that most Canadians rarely want to stick out their neck out and become involved so the law breakers will continue breaking the law.


2] With the stocking rates @ Muir, the bulk of the first years stocking may reach the Harvest Length. But I would suspect that the second and subsquent stockings will not and Muir is revert to what seems to be the norm for Alberta. Overstocking! And little fish - but lots of them. Millions or at least several hundred thousand. Wished it were different. Held out a lot of hope for Muir to raise larger fish.







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Don great to here you fishing the great waters of the Edmonton area. Hope to see you next weekend yanking out some of those nasty beaver dams.


But on this note of Calling or not Calling report a poacher. I have really mix emotion Tims way sounds nice but what it boils down to is with every licence sold regulations are supplied. If your that avid fisherman that one is asuming when purchasing the licence should have read and understand what the regulation is to the body of water they are fishing. That means that the excuse I didn't know that is kind of lame. That goes for bait if you read it in the regs it speifically spells it out anything used that has a scent to atrack fish is classed as bait (last time I saw power bait it sure stunck) so gain the excuse of oh I didn't know that, theroy has gone out the door.


Maybe what should be implement is a law stating that if your caught with out a set of regulation on you either in your fishing box vest or jacket that there should be a huge fine then we can save all kinds of money on putting up signs and also worrying about vandlisum to replace these signs. (interesting concept) I just know that I look at my regs. anytime I'm going to a new area or lake.


So Don I agree maybe its time these people learn what the regs are all about. I've been told that sometimes the school of hard knocks can be a good teacher.


I believe in education but how much and for how long do we do it. Yes we need money put to Education of our sport but it would be nice if we didn't have to put it into unneccessary education. Again maybe what we need is a test of some kind prior to getting a fishing licence strickly on the regulations and fish Identification. Or as what has been suggested that we have a 2 licence system for meat eaters and catch release but still have the testing on the regs. It seems everything else that needs licencing has a test of sort.


Don please keep calling and Tim Keep talking both have marit. I will try both ways Tims first then Dons depending on response. I like Don am out there to fish and am not sure I want to give up valuable time fishing as it seems that the human rat race already takes up alot of my fishing time already.


My 2cents


Tight Lines Always

Dennis S


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Dissertation Dave here.

I'll TRY to keep it short.

I also am of two minds as to how to treat encountered poachers.


On The RAP side:

1. Agreed that ignorance is no excuse.

Too many use it as a ploy to avoid embarrasment or deflect criticism.

2. Bait is Bait. The letters B*A*I*T in Powerbait should be the first clue.

3. Overharvest has killed more than one fishery in AB.

To some extent that can be attributed to poaching.

We need to put a stop to that.

4. RAP avoids possible on-the-water confrontations.

5. A call from F&W or a fine can work as a deterrent .. for the next time.

6. The bucket Brigade has plenty of lakes to fish already.

7. Given lack of F&W patrolling, if we don't RAP, who will.

8. Some people just don't believe the law applies to them.

9. I have a very low tolerance for studied or wonton disregard of the law.


On the Education side:

1. Many fishermen in AB don't bother to read the regs

other than to see if their favorite water is open or closed.

Remember the education campaign F&W instituted for Bulls & barbless?

They too recognize that many anglers are not familiar with the regs,

particularly when they are complicatd and change year to year.

2. I'm not a F&W or peace officer, so can't directly enforece regs.

However, I'm there on the water and can try to educate.

At the least, it might stop that specific instance and save a fish or two.

3. Confrontation can lead to serious problems,

so when approacing a possible poacher,

polite and educational is not only good PR, but safer.

4. C&R has the "elitist" stigma for some fishemen.

If we are polite and educational nice guys in teh field,

maybe that reputation will soften and more C&R become possible.

5. Lots of fishermen don't practise C&R or fly fish

because they find the skills intimidating and think success less likely.

A little education could help dispel that reluctance.


In the end, I think I opt for a bit of both.

1. I might first size up the situation to see if the poacher is ignorant

or just plain defying the law.

2. The best way to do this is a polite introduction and question or two

followed by a polite reminder of what the regulation is.

3. If I face hostility, arrogance, defensiveness or no response,

then I would proceed directly to RAP.

4. If they just pack up and leave, I might consider RAP

depending on what their demeanor was when questioned.

5. If I receive slightly positive response like: I misundestood the regs

I might suggest that ignorance of the law may get them in trouble

and in the long it would pay to read them before breaking them.

6. If I get a positive response, like: opps, sorry, I didn't know etc.

and their demeanor is pleasant, I might go a step further.

I might offer to show them how to rig spinnig gear up

to use a fly instead of bait or give them a tip on what fly to try

or maybe even how to cast a fly line.

You never know, you might make a convert.

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I've been the advocate of reason, the voice of moderation, the bearer of education and try to set a decent example for 40 years. And where has it got us. More poaching!! So, I'm no longer the advocate of reason, the voice of moderation, or the bearer of education. The good example is now - RAP the suckers. That beats the devil out of the second option of buffalo sticks and a flat shooting rifle although not nearly so satisfying.


It's curious how I've changed. When the East Slopes Hearing were on, Barry and I BS'ed many a time about what we'd like to see. And after they were published, I told Barry that 10% of the work is now done. Enforcement would provide the other 90%. Took about 5 years before he came around and Streamwatch is the result.


Examples abound about what we know is bad for us and what we do.


1] Drinking and Driving - we all did it - knew it killed folks and contined to do it until the penality became $600.00 and loss of privilges for a year.

2] Seat Belts save lives - now we conform - logic wouldn't do it. A $200.00 fine did.


Rat them out and benefit the resource.






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Once in awhile i fish with a guy that is retired, and he wants to keep everything he keeps... i try to tell him to threw some back for tommorow and he says oh no they are grocieries....he even gets mad at me when i throw mine back figures i should keep them for him..... i tell him i catch them and i will do what i want with them and i want them back in the lake ....he gets mad at me i tell....i keep trying to educate him on this but he doesn't seem to understand but on the other hand he talks about meat hungry fisherman and he doesn't realize he is one. I remember growing up and watching my dad and his friends bringing home everything they caught i couldn't understand it...both of my boys learnt from a young age it was catch and release ...my boys are 17 and 23 now and i really believe that they will pass it on to there kids so i think we r going in the right direction but it just seems like it is taking to long....has to be handed down from parent to child i guess....just my 2 cents worth

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It's great that you taught your kids to practice Catch and release. And it is great that you practice it as well. But you gotta realize people are allowed to keep fish. That is why they stock them. You pay for this when you buy your license. I don't understand why people get so upset when you keep a fish. I thnk it is your right and should not have to explain yourself in doing so. Also on the onther hand, Your friend should realize, like you said, you got it you shall do what you please. But if anyone told me what to do with my fish, either c&r or keep, I'd have 2 words for them.... and they are not "Merry Christmas".


I think people have gotten to hung up on C & R. You buy a license, all your gear, boat, truck, fuel... ect. I think you should without a doubt be able to keep them if you catch em. Now again... only keep what you are gonna eat. "MODERATION" is the key word here. If every one threw back what they caught, look how many people would be out of jobs...ie. hatcheries.


ANyway... gotta run... sorry couldnt finish my thoughts.... I'll add on later... g'night

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I have no problem with people keeping fish...but he keeps his five and wants to keep my five that i but back to....i am a believer of fishing tommorow to and not just today is all, i keep the odd fish and know that i have the right to but on the other hand i know that i have done my part to conserve them to...just my opinion

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Just a point on semantics, or should I say point of view.

Firstly, fishing licence fees contribute almost zero to hatchery costs

Most of SRD's money for that comes out of general revenue

(income tax, fuel tax, oil and gas royalties and gambling proceeds)

Secondly, stocked fish belong to ALL taxpayers, not just those who buy fishing licences.

So when you "take" a fish, you are taking a little bit of what everyone in Alberta owns.

Put that way, keepng a fish is a priviledge, not a right.

And priviledges come with responsibilities and obligations.

With 350,000 licenced fishermen in Alberta and about 4000 lakes

If everyone of them kept their limit evey time out,

pretty soon there would be nothing left for anybody.

Fortunately not every licenced fisherman is that good or lucky.

For those that are, awareness of the numbers and impact of keeping fish

should be balanced against self gratification.

Always keeping in mind future angling possibilities.

I too kill a fish from time to time, but always with the future of the fishery in mind.

The odd fish killed from a stocked "put and take" lake where the fish don't reproduce,

is not likely to do any harm. But a trophy spawner from growth limited habitiat will.

And as for keeping someone else's limit, that is against the law.

Caught fish are not transferrable to others. Read the regs.

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What i was refering to with the hatcheries, is that if noone kept fish from stocked lakes...why would they need to stock them.... not so often anyway. How many fish are stocked in carson lake every year? 3 stocking totalling 150,000 or so i was told. Not sure if that is exact. but what would happen if noone kept a fish.... Look whats happened to are walleye populations with the No keep law. Walleye are plentiful, and big.... but they are starting to starve in some lakes... and in most those lakes there is almost no bait fish left. Example Pigeon lake. HUGE Walleye there. But no perch or whitefish left. And the pike are skinny as heck. Same with lac st anne lake isle....


Yes, I know your not saying to not keep any, but what would happen if noone did. Whats gonna happen at muir when the fish get to that 20" inch size? What if noone keeps them, whats gonna happen to the population as the fish keep getting bigger? Also, on the othere hand, how many of you are gonna be upset when people do start taking the fish from that lake? I can imagine a few will be very annoyed with that....


I have also heard that the population of fish at muir is not going as fast as suspected... Could that be because of such high pressure from the fishing?Or could there just be to many fish competing for food there? Maybe a few fish being kept would be such a bad thing now.... Just a thought.


now lets see who the first to jump down my throat is.... I have a good idea.....



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This thread has sure gone sideways....

Ok Dave, I do need to respond to a few comments in your last post;


"With 350,000 licenced fishermen in Alberta and about 4000 lakes"

In fact, the statistics show that license sales have declined since peaking in the mid 1980's with only approx. 213,000 sold in 2004.

As for # of lakes...the number of sport fish bearing lakes in Alberta is in the order of 1000.


"I too kill a fish from time to time, but always with the future of the fishery in mind."

We can get into the argument about numbers, but I think we can agree that fish mortality due to catch and release fly caught fish is likely in the order of 5 to 15%.....so....the next time you go down to Grizzly Junction and you have that 100 fish day, keep in mind that that your self gratification may have just cost the lives of 15 grayling.

In this case, isn't the guy who legally keeps his limit of 2 grayling out of a Swans Hills stream much more a steward of the fishery than the C&R flyfisher who killed 15?


"The odd fish killed from a stocked "put and take" lake where the fish don't reproduce, is not likely to do any harm. But a trophy spawner from growth limited habitat will."

I agree with the first sentence...but...isn't a "trophy spawner from a growth limited habitat" exactly what you are trying to get Muir to produce? Perhaps a "spawner from a lake/stream where natural reproduction takes place" would be a better

choice of words.


"So when you "take" a fish, you are taking a little bit of what everyone in Alberta owns."

I would love to hear your thoughts about those that profit off of our fishery without compensation!


And, as for obeying the law....well, I will bet that more than a few around the forum here still practice that little white lie...."Oh, I forgot to debarb"....


Dave, in general I agree with what I think you are trying to say...but we need to be careful as to HOW it is being said. We must also understand that, like it or not, we as C&R flyfishers also impact the fishery. All fisherman leave their "footprints" on the resource...only some are larger than others.

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@albertabowhunter...regarding your comment on walleye. Yes, they are huge in some of the lakes...but....the thing that most folks don't understand is that the full range of age classes is not yet present in these lakes. The big fish are just now starting to reproduce and we are seeing a lot of large fish (the stockers) and some of the little guys (spawn of stockers). What is missing is the "teenagers" if you will.

It will take some more time to achieve the full range of year classes.

Don't be fooled by a presence of "large" fish....it does NOT necessarily indicate a healthy fishery.

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And what I'm saying is " is it all right for every other species in the lake to be lost so we have healthy walleye populations?


Lake Isle, Lac st anne, Pigeon lake, all had healthy and large perch. and lots of them.... now go there and see what you can catch.... perch are smaller and a heck of a lot fewer.... In fact, at the fishing holes fishing tournament this past winter, I dont think a single perch was weighed in... oh, yeah, and three whole fish were weighed in if I remember correctly too.... like I say, "sacrificing other species to save one", Is that right?


And now back to our regularly scheduled posting....


Heres a thought (Completely off target)


"Either the net your using is to big for the fish you catching, or the fish your catching are too big for the net your using..."


sounded better in my head.... :unsure:

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Dont' want no flame war, but a couple of returns are warranted.

To Flycaster:

By your math the ratio of fishermen to lakes is worse than by mine.

Regardless of the exact numbers, there's still too little water

for the number of fishermen to support large catch rates for each.

So the priniciple of "limit your catch rather than catch your limit"

should still be a responsible angler's approach.

Yes, I recognize that C&R has a certain mortality.

We can argue about the numbers here too if you want.

(I understand good C&R technique can keep mortality under 2%)

I've had few 100 fish days, even on the Little Smoky,

but yes, my angling there probably kills a few grayling.

But then I'm not a PETA type.

I understand that mine is a blood sport

and that some animals will be harmed in it's pursuit.

I don't worry as much about the legal limit guys

as I do the freezer fishermen who ignore limits.

I trust that responsible fisheries mangement will set limits

that the fish population and angling pressure can stand.

Yes, I intended spawners to mean "in appropriate habitiat".

I would regard Muir as a put and take fishery

with delayed harvest to manage for larger fish.

As for debarb, I ALWAYS check,

if ony to practice lower pain C&R on fishermen (myself included)

And I'm not sure what you mean by

"those who profit off our fishery without compensation"

Are you talking about unlicenced fishermen?



Dont jump to the conclusion that managing for large fish

means that smaller fish and other species will suffer.

There are a whole host of factors that determine size and survivability

of any given species at any given time.

I do know that walleye must reach a certain size and age to spawn

and as fycaster points out, that for collapsed fisheries

until they span a few times several age classes will be missing.

Whether or not the smaller pike and fewer perch are the result

of managing for spawning walleye is open to question.

Zero limits on pike may have moved fishermen to target perch instead

and declining perch populations may have an adverse impact on pike.

And that doesn't even consider natural populaton variations

or non fishing related environmental impacts like water quality.

All it points out is that fish management is very complex

and that "you can't just do ONE thing",

Every action has consequences beyond the simple and obvious.

Edited by dave robinson
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I agree with you on the above. But From what I have noticed and others I have talked to, it seems we have all noticed the same. Walleye lakes where the populations are so great, the fishing for other species bites...(for lack of a better term) Perch populations are way down, and pike are scrawny, not to mention the increasing lack of whitefish. (but whitefish pops are even more affected by over fishing in the winter months, which is a whole new topic which I'll let someone else open....).


Lakes like South Buck which has a minimum keep size of 50 cm(if I remember correctly) have lots of fish... hundreds and hundreds all in that 48-49.5 cm size. As soon as one grows beyond that 50cm size and is caught its gone. this lake still has an ok perch population and the pike are normal sized and healthy. Look at a lake like Calling. This lake your allowed 1 walleye a day, any size. THis lake has very beafy pike and a heck of a lot of perch too.


I agree that we need to bring are walleye populations back up, but They gotta do something about the rest of the fishing in Alberta. SLot size these walleye, and allow some to be kept over a year. say maybe 3 days a month on varying sizes. and have different lakes in similar areas... that way it keeps the number of fisherman down per lake. or maybe like hunting, you get tags.... maybe 2-3 walleye a year per person on certain lakes.... I dont know. It could be expesive, but what is our fishies worth.


Any how... There is a a problem. and no, I'm no expert.... but we gotta do something about the other fish in this province ei pike, whitefish, and perch... or we may just end up with nothing but walleye and stocked trout lakes...



my 2 pennies worth... take it for that.

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I agree that my numbers make the ratio of fisherman to lakes even worse but if we're going to throw out numbers like that, let's use facts....that is why I corrected you.

I also fully agree with your comment "there's still too little water

for the number of fishermen to support large catch rates for each.

So the priniciple of "limit your catch rather than catch your limit"

should still be a responsible angler's approach."...and with this comment I think you have hit the nail on the head with respect to fisheries management in Alberta....It is apparent that the limits are still too liberal. But do you think anyone at SRD will have the b@lls to impose total C&R...not likely. Heck even posters here want to increase walleye limits...then just have a chat with some of the folks at AFGA who want the same.


I'm not a PETA type either, but by the same token we must be aware of the world around us. In Europe for example, C&R is being frowned upon more and more...whether we like it or not, some folks view it as cruelty. All I'm saying is be careful of the road you choose for one day you will have to travel it!


Regarding your comment "I trust that responsible fisheries management will set limits that the fish population and angling pressure can stand."...I wish I could say the same but I'll go on a limb here and say that unfortunately I don't think that's the case. Simple facts are that there are NOT enough funds to adequately manage our fisheries...to date "management" has been reactive as opposed to proactive...cases in point 1) near extinction of Bull trout, 2) collapsed walleye fisheries, 3) collapsed pike fisheries.


Regarding my comment about profiting...I was referring to guides, tournaments and other commercial ventures that use the resource with out compensation and at the same time diminish the quality and impact your ability to enjoy that resource.


No flames...good discussion....

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If I remember my post correctly, I was talking about a combination of education and enforcement. If anglers have an ethic of stewardship then there will be more and bigger fish for all. On the other hand if you just go with enforcement the poachers will just go deeper into the bush.


Don's example of drinking and driving is perfect - they pushed all this enforcement with checkstops and policing but the numbers didn't really drop until an education campaign came out and showed people how irresponsible it was to drink and drive. Now a days it would be easier for someone to admit they were a member of Al Qaeda than drinking and driving.


I remember giving a cop a hard time about my seat belt ticket (back in the 80's) but that commercial showing a pumkin split when it hit the telephone pole sure helped change my mind.


I remember when Streamwatch started and their sole mission was to bust poachers, now their ad in this year's AFG has education listed ahead of enforcement. In fact, I think the best legislation for fishing (C&R on our trout streams) did not get near the bang it could have because it was not backed by a campaign that explained why Alberta's anglers should adopt it. Its easy to preach C&R to the converted - the only problem is that the converted are a minority of fishermen. Just this morning I was told by another camper that it was "STUPID" that you can't keep fish from the Embarass and this is 10 years after the regulations came into effect. (BTW - he chilled once I explained whe it is is C&R).


I really don't think it is hard to turn 95% of the anglers over to a view of stewardship rather than body count, but you have to deliver a consistent and understandable message. For the other 5% we have RAP.





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And what I'm saying is " is it all right for every other species in the lake to be lost so we have healthy walleye populations?


Lake Isle, Lac st anne, Pigeon lake, all had healthy and large perch. and lots of them.... now go there and see what you can catch.... perch are smaller and a heck of a lot fewer.... In fact, at the fishing holes fishing tournament this past winter, I dont think a single perch was weighed in... oh, yeah, and three whole fish were weighed in if I remember correctly too.... like I say, "sacrificing other species to save one", Is that right?


And now back to our regularly scheduled posting....


Heres a thought (Completely off target)


"Either the net your using is to big for the fish you catching, or the fish your catching are too big for the net your using..."


sounded better in my head.... :unsure:

Interesting point BowHunter - however, you're missing some of the real issues.


Pigeon, Wab - and a few others with some large Walleye as a result of the C&R rules have no tweens, and no little ones... at least not yet - stabilization takes years.


And why do you suggest we are sacrificing one species for another? Are you suggesting that the walleyes are eating the rest out of house and home - or are you suggesting that the focus has shifted to the other species which are taking a beating in place of the walleye...?


In collapsed fisheries - there are few 'good' solutions - that is to say - solutions that do not impact the "harvest opportunity" as it is described by SRD.


Personally - I think for the population to truly recover - it's gotta be a C&R for the harvest impacts to be reduced to a point where the waterbody can attain some form of equlibrium. It will sort it self out.


These waterbodies were self sustaining for years - right up until we started with the 500 lund boats / day / waterbody problem.


Interesting all the anglers/waterbody numbers floating about too.


Last stat I heard (from SRD) was that there were 312 anglers / waterbody (2001) in Alberta - compare to 12 in Saskatchewan.... We are in a bad place where pressure is concerned.


If out intention is to save the resource - we must return to a circa 1900 level of mortality (aka C&R). If we want to save the resource, and return to the circa 1900 level of mortality, we need tight regulations, effective enforcement, and spend a few years at Hogwarts boning up on our magic.





(Whooooosh! Poachers rod sails through the air into the lake deep....)

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